ELTE SEAS

Discussion Forum
It is currently Sat Nov 18, 2017 12:50 pm

All times are UTC + 1 hour




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Vast amounts
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 8:26 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:43 pm
Posts: 418
Location: ELTE BTK
Melgirl wrote:
Usually in Hungary sums of government financial help are counted in 100s of millions of forints. Then again it sounds like a lot but it might not be.


Well, since 60 mill is the monthly salary of TTK only (I'm sorry, that's the only one I know), I don't find this a lot of money. I mean, from the univ.'s aspect. Otherwise, of course, I would be quite glad to recieve such amount of money :wink:

_________________
.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Bernát Klári

angol SzHÉK
angolszhek@gmail.com
http//angolszhek.uw.hu


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Vast amounts
PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2005 1:09 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:24 pm
Posts: 118
Usually in Hungary sums of government financial help are counted in 100s of millions of forints. Then again it sounds like a lot but it might not be.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who indeed
PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2005 11:37 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:02 pm
Posts: 98
Location: Budapest
Melgirl wrote:
Now i don't know whether the government is actually giving vast sums of money to the universities but if they aren't it's probably because they don't see free education as being terribly economically viable. But if they are then the problem lies elsewhere...


Well, it depends on what you mean by vast amounts. And of course there is a lot of anecdotal evidence about state money being 'mismanaged' by the university. But below the surface, the real problem is that we try to uphold a socialistic model of free higher education in a capitalistic setting, and this just cannot work. So I agree with you, the whole thing is not viable economically, but no one wants to admit it because it would be politically incorrect and/or unviable.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Who indeed
PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:51 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:24 pm
Posts: 118
True- political parties are looking to see where they can win votes rather than do something useful. I believe in a free flow of information to everyone and the cheaper the better but as students we have to face it that studying for free is unfeasible when the paint is peeling off the walls of unis, teachers are being made redundant, computers are few and far between, and three or four televisions exist amongst the departments (at least SEAS and the quality usually leaves a lot to be desired) to name a few of the problems. Now i don't know whether the government is actually giving vast sums of money to the universities but if they aren't it's probably because they don't see free education as being terribly economically viable. But if they are then the problem lies elsewhere...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2005 9:30 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:02 pm
Posts: 98
Location: Budapest
I like the scheme :) (really!) And it looks feasible (at least it is in Australia). But such a scheme would have many enemies: university presidents/rectors would start whining about the autonomy of universities and all that stuff, many students would go to the streets to defend their perceived birthright to study free etc. And then which party of ours would take on such an immensely unpopular decision?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Exactly
PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2005 6:00 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:24 pm
Posts: 118
It is precisely b/c of the political news these days that it is up to people to keep on coming with the ideas. Hopefully someone (either those in power or those aspiring for power) will listen and do something. If not- well history has shown examples of what happens then.
And all this is lovely but does not criticism exist to the tuition scheme? Pros/ cons? Other ideas?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 10:41 am
Posts: 17
Absolutely true! And I wouldn't claim I am not an idealist in general - I am!
It's just that political news are quite worrying these days. However, I hope things will turn in a better direction in the future...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:25 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:15 pm
Posts: 808
If you students are not idealists, we're doomed.

_________________
szp


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 10:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 10:41 am
Posts: 17
Ideally, yes... :?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 1:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:02 pm
Posts: 98
Location: Budapest
nagyidus wrote:
Anyway, it's not our task to give hints to the government or whatever.


Well, whose task is it then? I mean, that's what democracy is all about: people giving their opinions and the government listening.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Interesting
PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 1:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:24 pm
Posts: 118
Quote:
I merely wanted to say here that I could not agree with Melgirl's opinion. Anyway, it's not our task to give hints to the government or whatever

My opinion about the current system? or the suggested one?
why can't we give hints and why isn't it our job to- after all people in parliament are a representation of the people's wants (theoretically), ideas and beliefs. as we can't all sit in parliament to raise the issues we (the population) do so when the opportunity arises in for example forums (though i doubt any government representative will bother to read any of these postings :D )


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: possible
PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 1:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:24 pm
Posts: 118
you're right anything is possible, except that i for one have to travel a lot to get here and get home. as i am up at 5.30am and not at home till about 8 pm i enjoy keeping my weekends for study and not for listening to the rantings and ravings of an overpaid individual who doesn't want to understand my predicament. i worked next to school and i know that working is possible next to it and enjoyable but not an option right now. the problem is that the system loses track of people like this. i also know of people who work next to uni and none of them are looking like roses in full bloom themselves.
and the problem is not that i don't live in budapest. even if i did and getting to uni would not be difficult, working 10 hours a week would not pay the rent let alone everything else.
i'm running on about 5 hours sleep per day sometimes even the weekends aren't enough to recharge.
but anyway that's off the point.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 1:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 10:41 am
Posts: 17
Ancsur, why don't you ask this question at the other topic?
I have never ever talked about working part-time or whatever because I myself could not have the time for this, having two majors, 19 study units and being generally from 8.30-7pm at the uni. Thanks God, I can lean on my parents' help - but I hate this whole misery about discussing other people's financial situation! :x
I merely wanted to say here that I could not agree with Melgirl's opinion. Anyway, it's not our task to give hints to the government or whatever.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:58 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:43 pm
Posts: 418
Location: ELTE BTK
Ancsur2002 wrote:
Ok, listen. You guys talked about working and parental help in the previous topic. Every day, I start lessons at 10:00, and finish at 17:00 or 19:00. So tell me, how can I go to work? Work till midnight, and no sleep, no homework or what? My parents don't even give me money to buy books, since they are expensive, and I don't get money to eat, so I don't eat anything during the day.
Tell me, how did you think that people in a financial situation like me, how could we spend more money, if we don't even have any???!


It might sound a bit lofty, but I last term I could make 35 credits with a 4.5 average last semester, and could work about 10 hours a week, sometimes even more, so I don't find working beside school that horrible. This is simply because I do need the money and still am interested in scholarly topics. If you don't have the time weekdays, you can work on Saturdays, for example, and so on, but I think its not impossible, only needs a little bit of organization.

Yeah, I know, that's not too nice from me. But there are so many people who work beside school that I really can't imagine that some can call it impossible... Really. Or think of the mothers of 2-3, making their univ. career! I think that they are in a much more difficult position than us, still, they're able to make it!!!

_________________
.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Bernát Klári

angol SzHÉK
angolszhek@gmail.com
http//angolszhek.uw.hu


Last edited by clarika on Wed Mar 23, 2005 2:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Breaking it down
PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 7:48 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:24 pm
Posts: 118
Obviously for people who cannot work (myself included) the present system is not too helpful- students receiving very little funding and no chance to go out and work in the mean time. I know the feeling- classes for me start at 8.30 on 4 out of 5 days and I don't finish until 5pm. This is what I was talking about vis a vis uni students and the ablity to work- just taking myself I'm spending at least 6 hours more each week at uni than someone on the other side of the planet.
Regarding the welfare state- it is not welfare that is paying the university education. People who work (inc. like I said a majority of the students) pay 33% of their income into tax. To the best of my knowledge the income tax in Hungary is some 30% also. Things like welfare and university tuition are paid out of the taxes collected from the people, like here, except the distribution of the funds collected is different (and I'm not just talking about the uni fees). The Treasury gets their money back from the students through the HECS, here I doubt they do. The system makes an investment in the students by paying their fees but with the economical forethought that they will get the money back sooner rather than later.
And regarding your point of too many university educated people- as the funding is given by the government they cut places when they feel that there are too many people entering university e.g. like now, and feed the money into TAFEs (which are trade schools). It's not just a case of let's spend money freely but juggling is done- when more skilled tradespeople are needed money and time is funnelled through a number of years into getting people to learn a trade rather than attend uni.
And this is just one of the differences between the systems- then there's the entry into universities and the student allowance...


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group